32 replies to this topic

[the DOC]

F4 C8 Y** (** = maximum amount of Y seats that will fit in the aircraft)

that's a rubbish config (no offence). You haven't done the maths

[ar157]

F4 is based on 1 row of 2 x 2 First class
C8 is based on 2 rows of 2 x 2 Business Class
 

Right, so what happens when you have widebody aircraft? lol huge aisle?

[Superman]

in some small commuter (express) type aircraft I use F2 C4 Y** (** = maximum amount of Y seats that will fit in the aircraft)

Like turboprop and CRJ types

You add  3 class configs in regional planes? wow you run impressive airlines.

[LLC]

Right, so what happens when you have widebody aircraft? lol huge aisle?

 
Basically in my experience, it is not possible to make a profit with more than 4 F and 8 C class seats
 
and think of the F seats as glorified business class seats:
(like on some airlines where you pay more for a
business "plus" class seat in the 2 buisness rows closest to
the front of the aircraft - Business Plus class)
 
as far as the following is concerned, I do not have a lot of
time to mess with seating configs, hence the F4 C8 Y** config
 

that's a rubbish config (no offence). You haven't done the maths

And most of my aircraft are narrow body aircraft anyways:
 
Narrow Body .......................... Config ............... In Fleet . On Order                         
Airbus A310-300 .................... F4 C8 Y257 ...... 3 ........... 389
Airbus A319-100 .................... F4 C8 Y137 ..... 74 ............ 40
Airbus A319-100LR ............... F4 C8 Y137 ....... 0 ............ 270
Airbus A320-200 .................... F4 C8 Y157 ..... 74 .............. 0
Boeing 717-200 ..................... F4 C8 Y111 ...... 21 ........... 595
Boeing 737-300 ..................... F4 C8 Y126 ...... 61 ............ 0
Boeing 737-400 ..................... F4 C8 Y165 ...... 54 ............ 0
Boeing 737-500 ..................... F4 C8 Y117 ...... 99 .......... 622
Boeing 737-600 ..................... F4 C8 Y126 ...... 24 .......... 357
Boeing 737-700 ..................... F4 C8 Y126 ........ 0 ........... 25
Boeing 757-200 ..................... F4 C8 Y216 ...... 48 ........... 398
McDonnell Douglas MD-83 .... F4 C8 Y149 ...... 24 ............ 0
McDonnell Douglas MD-87 .... F4 C8 Y116 .... 102 .......... 595
McDonnell Douglas MD-88 .... F4 C8 Y149 ...... 30 ........... 0
Embraer EMB 170 LR ............ F4 C8 Y57 .......... 0 .......... 50
Embraer ERJ-145XR ............. F4 C8 Y27 .......... 0 .......... 100
 
Wide Body ............................. Config .............. In Fleet . On Order   
Airbus A330-200 ................... F4 C8 Y383 ...... 5 ............ 0
Airbus A330-300 ................... F4 C8 Y417 ..... 22 ........... 0
Airbus A340-200 ................... F4 C8 Y397 ..... 17 ........ 120
Airbus A340-300 ................... F4 C8 Y417 ...... 7 ............ 0

Fleetwide ....................................................... 667 ......... 3561

[ar157]

by profit do you mean staying in the black or do you mean profit margins highers than 20%. Also, you didn't answer my question regarding widebodies. you have 2-2 in F, but on a wide body there are 2 aisles. so do you just have 1 aisle and make it humongous? 

[mxax-ai]

by profit do you mean staying in the black or do you mean profit margins highers than 20%. Also, you didn't answer my question regarding widebodies. you have 2-2 in F, but on a wide body there are 2 aisles. so do you just have 1 aisle and make it humongous? 

I think he meant the latter or a even higher number. I have no problem making a profit with more premium seats. And that number of economy seats would only be used by a ULCC. Looking at Air Transats A332 config, it shows 21 C and 322 Y seats. That is a less dense config than his, yet they have just 31'' pitch and extreme 16.5'' wide seats. Their business seats are what some airlines would sell as economy.

Intrestingly, he uses F and C on ERJs, where one is very likely not to fill 4 F seats.

[ArthurB]

I use these:

Aircraft..................F....C......Y..........IFE

767-200ER............4....30...197......YES

767-200ER*..........4....30...197......YES

787-8.....................6....36...240.......YES

A350-900R...........6.....36...279.......YES

A319-100(&LR)*..0....16...110.......NO

A319-100(&LR)....0....16...114.......YES

ATR72-600...........0.....4.....100.......NO

 

*Older A319 (& A319LR) and 767-200ER are being replaced by new ones with IFE. The same will occur with the rest of the fleet when the aircraft get about 17 years.

[Shaq]

Thank you for all of you inputs! and also for sharing the info

[LLC]

by profit do you mean staying in the black or do you mean profit margins highers than 20%. Also, you didn't answer my question regarding widebodies. you have 2-2 in F, but on a wide body there are 2 aisles. so do you just have 1 aisle and make it humongous?

our response to this thread is here:
LLC Airlines thread

[grimsleeper]

You add  3 class configs in regional planes? wow you run impressive airlines.

 

I run 3 class on regional but first class is a single seat.

[mxax-ai]

I run 3 class on regional but first class is a single seat.

No airline would - ever - put a single seat of any class in an aircraft, unless there's only space for a single Y seat. And the demand for F on regional flights is pretty much zero as comfort does not matter on such short stage lengths.

[ale444]

my 767- 300ERs seat 8f,12c,311y  and they are doing good

[KJS607]

Although that config would be profitable, that would certainly be very cramped in economy, Ryanair style legroom is certain.