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SET DAL FREE!!!


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#1
Scalpel4

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I support repealing the Wright amendment. I would like everyone else who does to please visit this site:

http://www.setlovefree.com

and voice their opinions to your respective government representatives. There is no good reason why North Texas cannot support two airports with national flights. Please visit this site and tell your friends to do this as well.

#2
Sunshine Airways CEO

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emmmm, DAL is free (in the game).

#3
Scalpel4

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This is real life, not the game. If we had an off-topic forum that people would regularly visit, I would post it there instead, but since this is pretty important I felt it would be better seen here.

#4
hpscot08

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Are, you from Dallas? Then you have no reason to even vote or sign on this. I am from Dallas, what I hear is a lot more than you hear. There is a good change if the amendment is repealed a lawsuit stating the master plan has been violated will close down Love Field. You hear this on the local news, not the national. Trust me, You do not want to sign this. Also, the senator raising the bill isn't evn form TX. He is from Las Vegas, guess what, Las Vegas just became SWA's city with the most passengers from SWA. Maybe there is a reason why nobody from Texas will bring any idea of this bill up! :P

#5
Maestro69

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Honestly, i dont really care. Im not even sure what the frikking issues are in this battle. Talk about American politics and restrictive practices!!!!! :P

#6
Salomon

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Thanks god im not american...

#7
Scalpel4

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Sorry to tell you, you know not of which you speak.

Well, I hear just as much. Onj the idea of DAL closing, this was a threat made by congresswoman Representative Eddie Bernice Johnson who received a sizeable donation from American Airlines that she would sponsor this bill. This was reported last night on NBC5 local news. It's also been proven that repealing Wright IN NO WAY violates the master plan, as flights will not increase because flights will be replaced with the longer haul routes, nor will noise or traffic. I do live near Dallas, and this idea was propoganda from AA. Besides, it's a MAJOR Southwest airlines hub, so why would they bo so gung ho for it if this were even a remote chance?

On the sponsor, the actual sponsor for HR 2646, which is the bill to eleiminate restrictions, has Rep. Jeb Hensarling (R-TX) sponsoring the bill, not someone from Las Vegas. As proof:
http://www.congress....46&congress=109
You'll also find Rep. Jeb Hensarling, R-Texas was a major contributor to this effort. Vegas? Who fed you that line of bull?????

TRUST ME, YOU DO WANT THIS! To whatever people "in the know" say against it, check the facts then you'll know the truth. And hpscot08, next time you speak up you really should be straight about the facts because it just makes you look like a tool, no offense, but WOW did somebody tell you wrong! :P

#8
Scalpel4

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Originally posted by Salomon
Thanks god im not american...


This is a disadvantage, far too often the nuts get control of the looney bin causing the majority a great big headache.

#9
Scalpel4

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Originally posted by Maestro69
Honestly, i dont really care. Im not even sure what the frikking issues are in this battle. Talk about American politics and restrictive practices!!!!! :P


It's definitely a protectionist law, designed to help one airline and hurt another.

#10
hpscot08

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LOL, your facts are so screwed up I bet you got them form the setlovefree.com site! :P

It's definitely a protectionist law, designed to help one airline and hurt another.


The Wright Amendment is a FEDERAL LAW that was put in place a full six years after the opening of Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport (DFW) to block long-haul flights out of nearby Love Field Airport. And if you were form the Dallas/ Ft. Worth area maybe you would be more informed. Instead of listening to one station's single story from DFW, you many have listened later in the ABC 8, CBS 11, FOX 4, or NBC 5, to hear where they said that the airport could be in danger if the amendment is lifted.


On the sponsor, the actual sponsor for HR 2646, which is the bill to eleiminate restrictions, has Rep. Jeb Hensarling (R-TX) sponsoring the bill, not someone from Las Vegas. As proof...


From a flightwright.com, a site tring to get Love Field set free: "July 19, 2005: Holy Smokes! A Republican senator from Nevada, John Ensign, has submitted legislation to the US Senate similar to what Rep Hensarling and Johnson had submitted. Senator Ensign's legislation is called the American Right To Fly Act. Could this be the beginning of the end of the Wright Amendment? Remember, it still has to be signed by the President who is very good buddies with Joe Barton, the chief opponent of any repeal efforts Only time will tell." Good try. :D

Here are some facts from a graphic I will try to put in my sig.:

"The Precpetion: Southwest cannot fly out of DFW because of the Wright Amendment legislation.
The Truth: Southwest could fly out fo DFW without any act of congress.

The Perception: Southwest will not fly from DFW because they do not want to compete with American Airlines.
The Truth: If Wright is repealed, Southwest wil compete with American Airlines at Love Field.

The Perception: DFW wants Southwest to cease operations at Love Field.
The Truth: DFW wants Southwest to begin only long-haul flights form DFW.

The Perception: Southwest cannot fly out of DFW because it is too congested.
The Truth: Southwest currently serves more congested major airports such as LAX."
[ http://www.keepdfwst...com/index.html]

#11
hpscot08

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This site has some quotes all of you need to read: http://www.keepdfwst.../southwest.html

#12
Maestro69

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Well, its good to know i nailed the topic with two words => restrcitive pratices!!!!!! :D

Oh well, and then they say the US aviation system is deregulated, hmmmm...

I wonder how long it takes for the perimter rule at LGA to be cancelled, though i got no clue on the issues for that or when it has been in place there. They really should just let airlines fly from any airport they wish and not be so gun-ho in trying to protect major airlines at major airports :P

#13
hpscot08

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Hmmm... Protect airlines at airports, Southwest has done this at Love Field, Southwest arguing to keep Texas Inernational out:
?The Love Field Legislation was intended to settle once and for all the ?dispute that has raged in the Dallas/Fort Worth area for many years. Now, TI [Texas International] seeks to reopen that fight and upset the delicate balance which has brought peace for the first time in over a decade. Congressional intent to the contrary is clear. Southwest does not object to TI using Love for intrastate flights (which apparently is all it wants to do) so long as the law is obeyed and TI?s certificate properly reflects what it may and may not do. There is simply no reason for the [Civil Aeronautics] Board to raise again the spectre of full scale commercial use of Love Field which has exacerbated this situation for so long, and which Congress has been to such pains to exorcise.?

--Response of Southwest Airlines Co. to Reply of Texas International Airlines, Inc. in Civil Aeronautics Board?s Review of Texas International Airlines, Inc. proposed service at Love Field, filed August 23, 1980, by Paul Y. Seligson, Attorney for Southwest Airlines Co, at p. 3. (http://www.keepdfwst.../southwest.html)

#14
piercey

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SET LOVE FREE!!!! :P

#15
Maestro69

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Why didnt they just demolished Dalls Love once DFW was up and running??

Wouldnt that have been the easiest solution?? :P

#16
Mexicana757

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Why is AA and DFW so afraid of having DAL open up??? The only reason they dont want it open is because they dont wan't to lose money (greed). All of those politicians trying to keep DAL are in AAs pockets. Thats the only reason why they act against it. Everyone gets something from someone.

If DAL is open, there would be more jobs created, more airlines would come into the airport, and of course lower fares for the flying public in the Dallas area. I'm sure Airtran and Frontier would jump to the airport if it was opened up.

Just because the Wright Ammendment is a federal law doesnt mean it cant be changed.

I think both DFW and DAL can co-exist with each other, take for example the airports in Chicago, HOUSTON, Orlando, NYC...

Hpscot88 where do you get your information, the websites for the Wright ammendment??

Anyways, SET DAL/WN FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Free market, competition, Do It!

#17
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I am not sure why DAL was not demolished, but...

Currently there is a surplus of airport capacity in the Dallas Ft. Worth Area (evident by Delta de-hubbing from DFW. This is a unique situation in the world (name another major city that has a surplus of airport capacity). In this situation, the airlines have more power than the airports (airlines can play off one airport against the other). Repealing the Wright amendment will give the airlines more power.

There are other issues. For example, if the Wright amendment is overturned, then the relevence of DFW will shrink to the point where someone like Qantas would not start flying to DFW to connect with OneWorld Partner American's hub. Remote, but possible.

I do not have a firm opinion, but the outcome will be very interesting to watch.

#18
piercey

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Listen, as one member of A.net put it,

"If an airport needs federal legistration to prop it up, then why is it still existing?"

SET LOVE FREE!!!! :P

#19
Scalpel4

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Originally posted by hpscot08
This site has some quotes all of you need to read: http://www.keepdfwst.../southwest.html


You mean I'm incorrect by quoting a Southwest sponsored site while you're correct for quoting an AA sponsored site? How about the other proof I provided about your "vegas" person? I quote you the congressional act with a link to the origninal act itself on the congressional website, with full information on it INCLUDING who sponsored it, and you quote some obscure website nobody's ever heard of? pleeeeeeease.

FYI, since the original act was started, I believe 8 other similar acts have popped up with variations. Perhaps you're quoting a variation that will be eventually merged into the original?

Oh, one more thing, sine you want Southwest to move to DFW, if the act is repealed and DAL is disbanded for some reason, then they'd have to move to DFW by default anyways, so you still get what you want anyways! So why do you complain? Do you work for AA? There's a strange motivation and inconsistency to your answers.

[Edited on 8/12/2005 by Scalpel4]

#20
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ALSO:

These quotes refute EVERY myth you just brought up . . .

Myth: Southwest is trying to fight the Love Field Master Plan, as a part of its effort to repeal the Wright Amendment.

Fact: Southwest Airlines supports the Love Field Master Plan. Southwest Airlines is headquartered in Dallas, employing more than 5,500 Dallasites who spend most of their waking hours in the Love Field area. We have been a "homeowner" in this neighborhood for 34 years, generating more than $13 million in Dallas taxes in 2004. We schedule our flights to avoid nighttime operations. We select our runways (weather permitting) to concentrate those operations on the far less populated side of the airport. Our Employees help lobby for roadway improvements in the area, they pick up trash around Bachman Lake, volunteer and help to purchase materials for local schools, and they frequent the shops, restaurants, and local businesses in the area.
We were proud to participate in the drafting of the Love Field Master Plan and have gone on the record multiple times saying that we will support it when the Wright Amendment is lifted. The Wright Amendment and Love Field Master Plan are separate documents that are not bound to each other. One is not contingent upon the other. There is an assumption that flights at Love Field will be "longer, lower, and louder" when in reality, commercial aircraft are flying "higher, further, and faster" from Love Field than ever before. Commercial carriers are governed by noise restrictions. In January, Southwest retired its last 737-200s. We now buy the "Next Generation" Boeing 737-700, a quieter, more powerful aircraft that climbs higher, faster and is built for fuel-efficient longhaul travel.

Myth: The Wright Amendment has allowed Southwest Airlines to grow and prosper. Southwest Airlines can trace its early existence and 34 years of success to the Wright Amendment.

Fact: The Wright Amendment is not the reason for Southwest Airline's success. Southwest's success is derived from a business plan that focuses on keeping costs low, flying a point-to-point schedule, quick turnaround times, and providing excellent Customer Service. Southwest began service in 1971, eight years prior to the Wright Amendment and after four years of legal battles. Southwest recorded its first profit in 1973, six years prior to Wright. The Wright Amendment was not meant to aid Southwest's success; it was a final legislative attempt to drive Southwest out of business after 12 years of court battles had failed to do so.

The Wright Amendment was created with the specific intention of protecting a then fledgling DFW in 1979 and to further restrict Southwest Airlines at Love Field, which continued to post profits to the chagrin of the other carriers. Since 1979, the circumstances have changed and DFW has become the world's third busiest airport, serving more than 53 million passengers last year and is adding additional service daily. Tiny Love is no threat to mighty DFW. Today, Southwest serves much of the United States. The Wright Amendment should be repealed so those Customers flying in and out of North Texas will have the same "Freedom to Fly" enjoyed by all other Customers around the United States.

Myth: The Wright Amendment does not give an unfair advantage to DFW, the law is good for competition and does not cause higher fares for passengers.

Fact: Southwest Airlines fares are consistently and dramatically lower than those offered by at DFW, using mileage comparisons for destinations around the country. If allowed access to longhaul markets from Love, consumers would benefit from DFW's airlines having to compete with the fares offered by Southwest at Love.

DFW is one of the world's premier airports served by many of the world's airlines. As competition from Love Field brings fares down, more passengers will use DFW. Overall airport revenue from parking, concessions, and passenger facility charges ($4.50 per passenger) will rise.

Myth: Southwest Airlines could provide better longhaul service from DFW and the recent incentive package offered by DFW makes changing airports a viable option for Southwest.

Fact: Southwest traditionally avoids fortress hubs like DFW, preferring smaller, less congested airports when available. This strategy has helped make Southwest America's only consistently profitable airline. American operates more than 800 flights, has a well-established customer base, and pricing power from being the largest airline in the world. Any carrier attempting to break into the DFW market with the minimum ten gates required by the incentive package will face an immense financial strain in an already struggling industry. By leasing the 10 to 22 gates that the package requires, an airline would need to operate around 80 flights a day.

Myth: Southwest Airlines can have the best of both worlds by operating regional service at Love and beginning national service at DFW Airport.

Fact: For 34 years Southwest has called Love Field home. Southwest's first flights were at Love Field, its corporate headquarters are located at Love Field, its stock symbol is "LUV" in honor of roots at Love Field, and it employs more than 5,500 individuals in the Metroplex who do not want to call DFW "home." Moving to DFW would split Southwest's operations between two airports in the same market, breaking up our low-cost, efficient model of business. Love Field service would have to be reduced to make DFW work, weakening Southwest's hard-earned market niche and endangering Employee job security.

Southwest Airlines is a growth company, but is prohibited from growing in its hometown. Passenger traffic at Love Field has declined significantly since September 11, 2001, as the automobile returned as a serious competitor to the airplane in shorthaul markets-the only kind of markets Southwest can serve under the Wright Amendment. Southwest must grow from Love Field to save jobs and protect our business.

Myth: The Wright Amendment issue can be resolved locally. The fight against the Amendment also threatens longstanding local agreements, bond covenants, and commitments from civic leaders and neighborhood associations that have been in place for more than 25 years.

Fact: The Wright Amendment is a federal law passed by Congress in 1979, and the only way it can be changed is through congressional action. Local, county, and state governments have no right or the authority to change this piece of federal legislation. In 1972, the DFW Regional Airport Board and the cities of Dallas and Fort Worth filed a lawsuit against Southwest, to force Southwest to leave Dallas Love Field for the new DFW Airport. This attempt to remove Southwest from Love was declared illegal in a decision upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court. The DFW parties sought this federal protection after all other city, county, and state governments and 12 years of courtroom judgments had refused to evict, or stop Southwest's operations from Love Field.

Southwest is not questioning the Love Field Master Plan, passed in 2001, that caps the growth of Love Field. Love Field is capacity controlled and cannot grow beyond what Love Field facilities will allow, regardless of what happens to the Wright Amendment.

Myth: Lifting the Wright Amendment would significantly increase traffic and noise at Love Field.

Fact: The Love Field Master Plan limits the growth of the airport and restricts the commercial capacity to the operation of no more than 32 gates. Old gates were demolished, and new gates will not be constructed. Many meetings and hearings took place between airport officials and neighborhood groups to ensure that the Master Plan limits noise, pollution, and ground traffic to acceptable levels. Hence, even with the lifting of the Wright Amendment, growth would be modest.

Southwest has retired many airplanes and replaced them with the Boeing 737-700, the only airplane Southwest is currently purchasing. All of Southwest's loudest planes, the 737-200, were retired in January 2005. The 737-700 is very quiet and powerful. It gains altitude more quickly thus diminishing the noise perceived by people on the ground. These newer airplanes have reduced the noise level at Love Field.

Houston's Hobby Airport, serving a market similar to that of the Dallas/Fort Worth area, has fewer than 25 more daily departures than Love and is an unrestricted airport. The unrestricted Hobby also peacefully coexists with the larger hub airport George Bush Intercontinental, stimulating lower fares, more traffic, and greater economic development in the region.

Myth: Keeping the Wright Amendment helps keep DFW strong. Only DFW Airport offers the opportunity for important corporate relocations and continuous economic activity.

Fact: The high fares at DFW prohibit and discourage new businesses from coming to North Texas. The average business fare at DFW is 48% higher than the national average, which many businesses find prohibitive. If forced to compete with the nation's largest low cost carrier at an unrestricted Love Field, DFW travelers would see their fares fall, stimulating more traffic and therefore increased economic growth in the region.

Many big metropolitan areas, including New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Houston, and Washington, have extensive service from two or more airports. More than ten years ago, a leading airport consultant advised the Dallas City Council that it should plan for a third area commercial airport. Competition at multiple airports gives people freedom of choice and, through competition, lower fares. Houston is an excellent example of how competing airports can coexist. The City of Houston benefits from excellent service and low fares. Hobby and Bush Intercontinental complement and support each other. Houston has both global reach and competitive airfares.

Myth: Southwest is challenging the Wright Amendment in order to "chill" low fare competition in North Texas.

Fact: Kevin Healy, vice president of planning for AirTran says, "The Wright Amendment issue isn't going to affect us one way or another."

Southwest Airlines, with 15 operational gates at Love, cannot "chill" low fare competition as stated by DFW. American presently operates 67 gates at DFW and still has several gates available for use at Love Field. American's operations, at DFW alone, would be almost triple that of all airline operations at Love Field, if Love operated at maximum capacity. Love Field simply does not have the capacity to siphon off any significant amount of traffic from DFW.

American Airlines carries 76% of all travelers to the Dallas Ft. Worth area and aggressively defends any encroachment on it routes by other airlines, thus "chilling" low cost competition at the airport. For example, in the summer of 2004 AirTran began offering two flights a day from DFW to LAX. American quickly fought back by matching AirTran's fares on all flights not only to LAX, but also on all 39 flights from DFW to other airports in southern California. By the June 2005, American will control more than 82% of the airport's commercial traffic that consisted of 53 million passenger departures in 2004. By comparison, Love Field's 2004 commercial traffic totals came to 2.3 million passengers last year.

Doug Parker, chief executive of America West, says that even with DFW incentive package, "We would lose a lot of money trying to compete with American Airlines at that level of service."

The Love Field Master plan further limits Love Field's ability to grow by restricting maximum capacity to 32 gates. Love currently has 25 operational gates. DFW has 140 gates with 28 gates being added next year when the airport opens a new terminal.
The U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT) has determined that when Southwest Airlines begins serving a new city, a phenomenon occurs. This consistent phenomenon was termed the "Southwest Effect" by DOT officials in a 1993 study. The most noted aspect of the "Southwest Effect" is that the average fare decreases and the number of passengers dramatically increases. Instead of chilling competition, Southwest's entrance into markets currently not allowed under Wright would stimulate low fare competition in the region.


Take THAT! HA!




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