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Double Standards of Gate Hogging

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#121
travelhouse

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What bugs me about building a Terminal, is that, lets say you have 25 gates at an airport, and you decide you need to expand more out of that airport so you build a Terminal. And your 25 gates go to the market, making it possible for someone to buy them all and build up a base there, so he can screw you.


Yes, when you build any terminal the old gates should be mothballed and never seen again.

Much like old aircraft, you can mothball them, gates should also be the same.

Only negitive is that then the feeder gate makers will be in full force making many more gates

Miller should be able to CAP the total number of gates that are able to be made, even if there was at the very start 100 gates for all locations and NIL gates issued when any new airline starts up, would stop all from complaining about gate hogging and gate feeders.

#122
LOT 737-300

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I think I found a nice incentive for people who build and own terminals, but it would require a pretty good rewriting of the script. Ok, see, since they own the terminal, they can choose "rent out" the gates and charge what they want when the ones from the airport authority are no longer there. That way, the airline would make money where and when it isn't using the gates. But I think someone who hogged gates said that they want to hog up all the gates just so they can have a whole airport to themselves (and their alliance buddies.) So this sorta causes a issue here where people just want to make the game playable to only themselves and a select few.

#123
ian

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Oh come on watchdog. Do you seriously think that these guys can't quickly recover from buying a new terminal? These guys must be making DOPs of 12 mil by now! Thats more than enough to recover from this really quickly. Plus, the terminals add up insantly to massive savings in montly gate costs. Here is a graph I quickly made while at the University this morning to show what I mean. It's not the greatest quality since I used MS paint on my laptop to make it and simply did the input of costs by hand, but I think it can give you the idea of what I mean.
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Long story short, building nice big terminal = some nice savings (millions if they built a nice big terminal)= more money for massive aircraft orders which can also equal more money to get gates elsewhere. Apparently, Miller had the idea of rewarding airlines that do this and let everyone else be able to play the game. Guess it didn't catch on.

DOP of 18 mil :D

#124
ian

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Yes, when you build any terminal the old gates should be mothballed and never seen again.

Much like old aircraft, you can mothball them, gates should also be the same.

Only negitive is that then the feeder gate makers will be in full force making many more gates

Miller should be able to CAP the total number of gates that are able to be made, even if there was at the very start 100 gates for all locations and NIL gates issued when any new airline starts up, would stop all from complaining about gate hogging and gate feeders.

i vote for this idea

#125
watchdog

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I personally don't like this as it still encourages gate hogging. If you know your skills, you'll scare off the competition before they get up there (or really beef up your hubs so you'll still have the higher LF).


take the top 10 players as of March 11, Year 3

song = no terminals
australis = no terminals
palm tree express = no terminals
american airlines = no terminals
kaaielem = no terminals
nibbles = no terminals
ian air = 1 terminal
minerva airline = no terminals
banana airways = no terminals
city link = no terminals

so only 1 of the top tem rankings has built

this must say that the game is played different to what you would like to see

the developers need to consider these facts in any new developements
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#126
ian

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how can you tell that i have built a terminal?

#127
watchdog

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how can you tell that i have built a terminal?

not me who looked at u balance sheet

he did :D

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#128
ian

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haha. so im guessing you looked at all of it for my one time expenses. the one from last month i had to extend my pre-existing terminal because i was stupid and didnt build a big enough one the first time

#129
glarus

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I think a compromise system would work best. Say, you can rent up to 20 gates, but then beyond that, you need to build terminals. That way, competition would still be suppressed a bit (the goal of amassing lots of market gates and not building a terminal) but it would still promote the idea that more people can get in there (because no carrier can take more than 20 public gates.) Building a terminal shouldn't cause a flood of gates on the market. The only way building a terminal makes sense now is doing it in a city where you don't already have a major operation.

#130
galapagapop

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Hey I'm not playing to play as normal this round I've lost interest, but let me also tell ya it doesn't make sense until a certain period of time, poor players often build terminals too early or buy big A/C too early, there is a phase in time that's needed.
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#131
Pacific

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Australis once embarked on an experimental strategy of terminals early in the game. It didn't work as it slowed down his aircraft deliveries, thus losing 4 places or so in the rankings.

This gate simulates the neo-liberal world of capitalism, which the "advanced" western nations use. People in this game, just like the world of capitalism will use any (legal) means to maximise their profits. Gate hogging your primary airport has proven to be the way to achieve profit maximisation. Ajax Air from 2 rounds back did not build a terminal in Orlando - her primary airport.

(Ironically, most players of this game are from those western nations and therefore should be ashamed for not understanding capitalism, considering how your leaders, the IMF and the World Bank promote this system globally.)

#132
LOT 737-300

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One thing these "advanced western capitalist nations" have that this game dosn't are courts that would look into unfair competition once people start to complain if there is unfair competition (and I don't wanna here someone come in here with that "life isn't fair" BS either). Look at Microsoft as a example, got too big and was said to be eliminating the competition and was ordered to cut down a bit. I could also throw other examples where monopolies were delt with if seen to be too brutal in the market and so on (though there are some government supported monopolies.)

#133
galapagapop

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One thing these "advanced western capitalist nations" have that this game dosn't are courts that would look into unfair competition once people start to complain if there is unfair competition (and I don't wanna here someone come in here with that "life isn't fair" BS either). Look at Microsoft as a example, got too big and was said to be eliminating the competition and was ordered to cut down a bit. I could also throw other examples where monopolies were delt with if seen to be too brutal in the market and so on (though there are some government supported monopolies.)

Not a proper example Microsoft pushed competitors out of the market and out of business, not so in AE. Also those gates were all free before, it's more a matter of planning than monopolization. If you wanted to be in LGA it's not Citylinks fault for having based ops there. Only oversight here is useless gate hogging, but holding all the gates and not using the terminal option isn't anything but good business, I don't ususally as I'm not on all the time to micro manage gates, so terminals offer me ease if I forget to put the days deliveries into place. As much of a bother it is, we don't need any socialist mumbo jumbo. Especially with the current structure that doesn't entail any sort of image or loyalty to airlines. Which would null any boom from entering a market suddenly to hit a competitor, which is still done in this game. I still see no point in making this an issue. Gate hogging for 30 gates is the problem, gate feeders is the problem, but terminals aren't for now and it's still void as nothing has changed in 2 years here at AE, we've actually lost more, credit, A/C aging, so forth. Time can be better spent playing the game, writing your own, or finding and reporting cheaters.
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#134
LOT 737-300

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Well, see in a way, the hoggers have pushed some airlines away form the game. Since they cannot expand for every two cities that the hogger managed to hog in (sometimes thats needed, most airlines that wind up having to operate routes where they max out the plane's range) , they just leave the game for good. Also, you have to concider that many airlines are in a position now where they are in a complete stand-still because they have gotten bitten by the gate hoggers and can't really move anywhere, the insane amount of multiple flights they put between two cities have made the routes highly unprofitable for all, if the airline could get a larger plane with more range, they wouldn't be able to use it since all the reasonable gates (including their base city) are no longer there.

#135
sawilson1971

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Jeez who let the liberals play this game, I thought you would be too busy trimming your beards to have enough spare time to play the game.
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#136
ian

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this has gotten out of hand

#137
travelhouse

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gate feeders is the problem, but terminals aren't for now and it's still void as nothing has changed in 2 years here at AE, we've actually lost more, credit, A/C aging, so forth. Time can be better spent playing the game, writing your own, or finding and reporting cheaters.


Very true indeed Banana so you making a rival to the game :D j/k

#138
LOT 737-300

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Jeez who let the liberals play this game, I thought you would be too busy trimming your beards to have enough spare time to play the game.

You serously don't think I don't play the game? Oh, and please, keep what you think my political stance on things out of here, this is about gate hoggers, not LOT 737-300's political stance.




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