11 replies to this topic

[KriZ]

Hi, as it states in the Political Restrictions; ‘you cannot fly between another eu country and a non-eu country’, Why is this? (considering it is unrealistic)

 

And since this is in the suggestion section, I’ll suggest that when you settle in a eu member state, you should be able to fly from another eu member state to a non-eu member state, as done millions of ways today.

 

Sincerely,

KriZ

[Arianka]

It's pretty realistic, it's just that in real life some airlines requested special permission, which is not possible in this game...me thinks.

[KriZ]

It's pretty realistic, it's just that in real life some airlines requested special permission, which is not possible in this game...me thinks.

 

No, the European Common Aviation Area acts like one entity, that's why airlines are allowed to travel between France and Germany for example even though the company has an AOC registered with the Irish Aviation Authorities. This also translates into that airlines are allowed to travel between Germany and Israel or the United States even though the company has an AOC registered with the Irish Aviation Authorities. 

 

You can see this in Ryanair's use of the UK AOC from Liverpool and London Stansted and the EU AOC from Dublin. Since Ryanair is having a European Country on one end, they can use their EU/Irish AOC for the operation between Dublin and Marrakech, but since the United Kingdom left the European Union and therefore the European Common Aviation Area; Ryanair cannot use their EU/Irish AOC from London Stansted (non-EU) to Marrakech (non-EU), they instead have to use their UK AOC.

 

I hope this cleared it up for you.

[KriZ]

No, the European Common Aviation Area acts like one entity, that's why airlines are allowed to travel between France and Germany for example even though the company has an AOC registered with the Irish Aviation Authorities. This also translates into that airlines are allowed to travel between Germany and Israel or the United States even though the company has an AOC registered with the Irish Aviation Authorities. 

 

You can see this in Ryanair's use of the UK AOC from Liverpool and London Stansted and the EU AOC from Dublin. Since Ryanair is having a European Country on one end, they can use their EU/Irish AOC for the operation between Dublin and Marrakech, but since the United Kingdom left the European Union and therefore the European Common Aviation Area; Ryanair cannot use their EU/Irish AOC from London Stansted (non-EU) to Marrakech (non-EU), they instead have to use their UK AOC.

 

I hope this cleared it up for you.

 

And of course use their EU/Irish AOC for flights between Marseille (EU) to Marrakech (non-EU), no trouble

[5280_Av8r]

I think the issue is because real life aviation is much more complex than this game. Ryanair UK is a subsidiary of Ryanair, so it's essentially a different airline which allows them to operate flights like that. Same thing with TUI having subsidiaries in several EU countries which allows them to operate international flights to non-EU countries from that country. The only way to simulate this in the came currently is to have multiple airlines in the same world (when possible) and have them all apart of the same alliance to achieve those connecting passengers that you'd get in the real world. 

[KriZ]

I think the issue is because real life aviation is much more complex than this game. Ryanair UK is a subsidiary of Ryanair, so it's essentially a different airline which allows them to operate flights like that. Same thing with TUI having subsidiaries in several EU countries which allows them to operate international flights to non-EU countries from that country. The only way to simulate this in the came currently is to have multiple airlines in the same world (when possible) and have them all apart of the same alliance to achieve those connecting passengers that you'd get in the real world. 

No, Ryanair UK allows them operate from a Non-EU country to a Non-Eu country, from the United Kingdom which left the EU and the Morroco which is not apart of the EU. 
 

Ryanair’s main AOC is what I am trying to convey here, that because they are registered in Dublin, Ireland with their AOC and Malta with their AOC, they are allowed as any EU airline can such as Easyjet (Switzerland/Austria AOC), Wizz (Hungary AOC) etc, to fly between a country which is a member of the European Union, to another country which is not a member of the European Union. 
 

I’ll simplify this by saying that they are registered in Country A (inside the EU).

and they fly from Country B (inside the EU, but not where they are registered) to Country C (outside the EU). 
 

I took Ryanair as an example of this earlier, but most of you seems to have been confused by it, I’ll try another one then.

Wizz Air together with it’s Hungarian AOC flies from Country B (Italy) to Country C (Albania), or from Country B (Serbia) to Country C (Denmark, Sweden, Germany, France, the Netherlands etc), or from Country C (Israel) to Country B (Romania, Poland, Italy, Austria, etc).

 

Wizz Air is allowed to do this because of its EU/Hungarian AOC, that allows them to act as if they have a AOC in any European country.

 

My entire suggestion is just based on allowing us to fly from Country B (inside the EU) to Country C (outside the EU).

 

Basically allowing us to use the full extent of the 7th freedom of the air. Not only flying within the EU, but also allowing us to fly from within the EU to outside the EU.

[KriZ]

If you wanted to watch a video on the topic, this video right here is highly suggested. I put the time set at the point which is relevant to this topic, but you can watch the whole video too, because it is very interesting to watch.

https://youtu.be/thqbjA2DC-E?t=722

[5280_Av8r]

If you wanted to watch a video on the topic, this video right here is highly suggested. I put the time set at the point which is relevant to this topic, but you can watch the whole video too, because it is very interesting to watch.

https://youtu.be/thqbjA2DC-E?t=722

I think part of the reason is because it's very difficult to implement the five freedoms and beyond into the game. Basically that's why they have the open worlds which is completely unrestricted, so it's still a little different but it's the closest thing. Because of how the tickets are sold in the game mechanics and how the passengers buy the tickets, it'd be very difficult to implement this until they introduce selling specific connecting flights. However it should be possible to allow international flights from any EU country to a non-EU country with the current system, so I guess idk why that is. The only reason I can think of is to take power away from spamlines.

[v35n]

You can operate a No.1 airline out of Europe. I had an airline based in France a few years ago, it was No.1 for 10 ingame years before I left it alone.

[KriZ]

You can operate a No.1 airline out of Europe. I had an airline based in France a few years ago, it was No.1 for 10 ingame years before I left it alone.

 

What does that have to do with this topic?

[v35n]

If one is starting a realistic airline, I don't see why one would need to be able to fly from an EU country outside your home country to a non EU one. Unless you are starting a budget carrier like Ryanair of course. In that case, I don't think they do any long haul routes either.

 

Politics is complicated, and this is the simplest arrangement possible. If I'm not wrong, airlines would have to apply to start a route from an EU country to a non EU country with the respective authorities. There are many airlines outside of the EU who operate flights outside of their home country, to another country. For example, Delta Air Lines has a route from Narita to Singapore and Manila, and United Airlines operates their Island Hopper service in the Pacific. They will have to obtain the rights to carry passengers between these countries.

 

 And the fact that this game has been out of development for a long time.

[KriZ]

If one is starting a realistic airline, I don't see why one would need to be able to fly from an EU country outside your home country to a non EU one. Unless you are starting a budget carrier like Ryanair of course. In that case, I don't think they do any long haul routes either.

 

Politics is complicated, and this is the simplest arrangement possible. If I'm not wrong, airlines would have to apply to start a route from an EU country to a non EU country with the respective authorities. There are many airlines outside of the EU who operate flights outside of their home country, to another country. For example, Delta Air Lines has a route from Narita to Singapore and Manila, and United Airlines operates their Island Hopper service in the Pacific. They will have to obtain the rights to carry passengers between these countries.

 

 And the fact that this game has been out of development for a long time.

 

What Delta does between Narita to Singapore and Manilla is not relevant, it's a completely different set of circumstances. In this topics circumstance, the game developer has implemented only one part of the two parts of the European Aviation Common Area's 7th freedom flying and not actually added the second part, being able to fly from Country B to Country C.

 

To fly from Country B (inside the EU) to Country C (outside the EU) being a EU Carrier is not which require such special permission in Delta's case, however United's island hopper flights are closer, as Guam is a territory controlled by the United States and since United is a US registered airline, this is no issue, but you also talked about long haul and low cost airlines. And yes, most expensive one-hub airlines will not have use for this, but in order to actually use the Airline Deregulation act, this is an important step to doing so. Low Cost airlines are not the only airlines using the 7th freedom, Finnair recently used it by establishing a base at Stockholm Arlanda to fly long-haul to the US, Thailand etc and AirBaltic recently used the 7th freedom right to establish a new base in Tampere, not to mention it's already established bases in Lithuania and Estonia as a Latvian carrier.

 

Norwegian was probably the main user of this freedom on long haul routes starting routes from Spain, France and Italy to the US without having a AOC in any of the mentioned countries. The video I linked also mentioned their use of the freedom from the US to Martinique and Guadeloupe.