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Transasia GE235


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#21
TNT88

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Then how would it have got off the ground safely in the first place? :P

As long as it got enough speed to rotate, it could still got off the ground, the problem usually start when the plane getting up at higher altitude.



#22
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You have to thank the pilot as well for not causing more deaths, He missed all the buildings and turned to try and miss the highway but failed somewhat.


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#23
Speed Bird

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As long as it got enough speed to rotate, it could still got off the ground, the problem usually start when the plane getting up at higher altitude.

 

You can rotate at a speed well below VR, you still ain't getting off the ground :P

 

A significantly overweight aeroplane is likely to be apparent from the very first stages of operation. A longer than expected take-off roll, degraded climb performance, sloppy handling characteristics, etc. Weight will of course affect the ceiling at which the aeroplane may safely operate. An overweight aircraft may not be able to climb nor sustain level flight at a specified flight level, which will again be quite apparent. Descending to a lower flight level will of course solve the problem. 

 

In regards to how this could affect the accident aircraft, the answer is not overly. On the assumption the aeroplane was having an issue with power and we have a dual engine failure, the aeroplane is gliding. The distance an aeroplane glides is independent of weight - it simply depends on the altitude of the aeroplane. What will change is the rate of descent, and will increase with additional weight. When an aircraft looses all power, the initial thing you want to do is get the aircraft to V best glide, ensuring you get the maximum distance and flight time. Now the accident aeroplane may have simply been too far from said airport when the problem occurred or the problem could have been mishandled. Of course there are other contributing factors. 

 

This is all based on the assumption of a dual engine failure and an overweight aeroplane. We do not know if this was the case and is simply speculation. Nevertheless, it is quite an interesting scenario to analyse. 



#24
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Well according to an article I read, its shows the pilot acknowledging an engine flameout..

http://www.usatoday....crash/22842757/

 

I'm not denying there may have been some form of engine issue, I'm saying that engine power loss is a manageable occurrence and is unlikely to be the specific cause of the crash. 



#25
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The pilots possibly could have been distracted by the engine failure, failed to maintain proper control of the aircraft and crashed?

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#26
TNT88

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You can rotate at a speed well below VR, you still ain't getting off the ground :P

 

A significantly overweight aeroplane is likely to be apparent from the very first stages of operation. A longer than expected take-off roll, degraded climb performance, sloppy handling characteristics, etc. Weight will of course affect the ceiling at which the aeroplane may safely operate. An overweight aircraft may not be able to climb nor sustain level flight at a specified flight level, which will again be quite apparent. Descending to a lower flight level will of course solve the problem. 

 

In regards to how this could affect the accident aircraft, the answer is not overly. On the assumption the aeroplane was having an issue with power and we have a dual engine failure, the aeroplane is gliding. The distance an aeroplane glides is independent of weight - it simply depends on the altitude of the aeroplane. What will change is the rate of descent, and will increase with additional weight. When an aircraft looses all power, the initial thing you want to do is get the aircraft to V best glide, ensuring you get the maximum distance and flight time. Now the accident aeroplane may have simply been too far from said airport when the problem occurred or the problem could have been mishandled. Of course there are other contributing factors. 

 

This is all based on the assumption of a dual engine failure and an overweight aeroplane. We do not know if this was the case and is simply speculation. Nevertheless, it is quite an interesting scenario to analyse. 

I'm actually talking about the "Dirty" business airlines done to get more revenue. You know, stuffing more cargo into the plane. I don't know for sure but since this accident doesn't involved the plane reaching a very high altitude, it might reach enough speed to level up but losing speed when it try to climb to higher altitude (You can try this stuff on FSX easily, not the most realistic way to analyst the situation but it would give you some point on it). It does look like it's gliding but it just looks a bit weird for me looking at the video. 



#27
Speed Bird

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I'm actually talking about the "Dirty" business airlines done to get more revenue. You know, stuffing more cargo into the plane. I don't know for sure but since this accident doesn't involved the plane reaching a very high altitude, it might reach enough speed to level up but losing speed when it try to climb to higher altitude (You can try this stuff on FSX easily, not the most realistic way to analyst the situation but it would give you some point on it). It does look like it's gliding but it just looks a bit weird for me looking at the video. 

 

I'm reasonably sure airlines in this day and age do not involve themselves in the 'dirty business' you speak of :P

 

I must be honest I hadn't really been paying attention to the details of the accident, basing what I've been saying purely on the footage. Hence I'm not only just aware this was during the departure phase of the flight. 

 

Nevertheless, I find weight to be an extremely unlikely cause. 

 

A mishandled engine failure may be more likely however, since we know there was some form of distress call. The belief that this call was a Mayday suggests to me it was a more serious issue than a single engine failure - most pilots I know would consider this more fitting of a Pan call, for the aircraft is controllable and no immediate assistance is likely to be required. A dual engine failure therefore is a possibility, and would account for the fact the aeroplane seems unable to maintain altitude. 



#28
Tesla

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An example of an overweight accident where the plane took off. Looks very different from the GE235 incident.



#29
TNT88

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I'm reasonably sure airlines in this day and age do not involve themselves in the 'dirty business' you speak of :P

 

I must be honest I hadn't really been paying attention to the details of the accident, basing what I've been saying purely on the footage. Hence I'm not only just aware this was during the departure phase of the flight. 

 

Nevertheless, I find weight to be an extremely unlikely cause. 

 

A mishandled engine failure may be more likely however, since we know there was some form of distress call. The belief that this call was a Mayday suggests to me it was a more serious issue than a single engine failure - most pilots I know would consider this more fitting of a Pan call, for the aircraft is controllable and no immediate assistance is likely to be required. A dual engine failure therefore is a possibility, and would account for the fact the aeroplane seems unable to maintain altitude. 

Well, that's pretty obvious isn't it? I'm not saying the aircraft is actually overweight, but since we don't know the main cause it could be one of the possibility.



#30
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An example of an overweight accident where the plane took off. Looks very different from the GE235 incident.

 

:facepalm: "An example of an overweight accident" cannot be used to determine the crash since there are at least dozens of other possibilities of what would happen IF the plane is overweight, especially since the plane on the video and the plane that involved in the crash is different.



#31
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I'm just saying. Overweight accidents rarely if ever happen on landing.



#32
Tesla

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I'm just saying. Overweight accidents rarely if ever happen on landing. They almost always happen on takeoff.



#33
TNT88

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^The plane crash minutes after take off, what are you talking about?



#34
Will101

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An example of an overweight accident where the plane took off. Looks very different from the GE235 incident.

I thought that flight was an issue with the elevator cables leaving the elevators stuck in place causing a stall?

 

EDIT: It seems after that from reading into a little more that both the elevator cables and an overweight departure both contributed to the crash. 



#35
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I'm not saying the aircraft is actually overweight.

 


Or the plane could be overweight.

 

You'll have to forgive me :P

 

Either way, the characteristics of an overweight aeroplane, to me, do not seem to be present based on the information we have available currently. 



#36
TNT88

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You'll have to forgive me :P

 

Either way, the characteristics of an overweight aeroplane, to me, do not seem to be present based on the information we have available currently. 

 

Actually, if you read my comment again carefully, you can see that I never stated that the plane is Actually overweight, I only stated that there is a possibility since we haven't found the actual causes of the crash.



#37
Boeing 707

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On another note, would you state the pilot(s) are a hero?

http://www.reuters.c...N0LA04N20150206


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#38
Speed Bird

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Actually, if you read my comment again carefully, you can see that I never stated that the plane is Actually overweight, I only stated that there is a possibility since we haven't found the actual causes of the crash.

 

Oh don't give me that bull****. 



#39
Speed Bird

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On another note, would you state the pilot(s) are a hero?

http://www.reuters.c...N0LA04N20150206

 

 

'Pilot's body found still clutching joystick of crashed Taiwan plane' You've got to love the incompetence of the media when reporting aviation related stories.



#40
TNT88

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Oh don't give me that bull****. 

Why you get mad at me? Because it's true? Maybe you should realize that a word could change the meaning of the whole sentence.






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